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Post by jgf on Oct 9, 2016 0:42:27 GMT
For some reason Vilja now has trouble mounting Bruse. She steps up beside him, facing him, and he slides sideways away from her, just a couple of feet. She steps to him again, and he slides away again. She looks like she's doing that ridiculous wedding march - one step, one step, one step ...and Bruse slides away each time (he doesn't move, just stands there like a statue, sliding away sideways each time she steps forward). After a few cycles of this Vilja may finally mount her horse ...but I've also sat and watched as they disappeared into the woods; one time, on the road near Leyawiin, they ended up with Bruse up to his belly in the water, Vilja standing beside him, and they just stood there.
If I ride off, Vilja will eventually warp to me and summon Bruse, but she never rides him; I can ride from Leyawiin to Anvil and every few seconds hear the sound of her summon spell behind me. And on a few occasions I've watched her summon Bruse then turn and walk to the other side of the road, immediately warp back to his side, and mount normally.
In any of these scenarios, once she has mounted Bruse we ride around normally.
Last night we rode back to Aleswell, went inside, I told Vilja to relax, and I went back outside. Both horses were standing there as usual, Bruse suddenly turns and gallops away full speed ...where or why I've no idea, but I've never seen him do that before (double check ...yes, I'm wearing my mage robe).
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Post by chambcra on Oct 14, 2016 14:17:08 GMT
This is pretty much normal. There's been a lot of discussion on it at the Nexus forum. It seems to me to be an in-game bug between the normal collision detection resolution and the in-game animation for the NPC horse mount. It looks like the same thing as when Vilja is in your way and you bump up against her and she slowly slides out of the way.I think it has to do with the angles and sometimes Vilja hits the bruse collision box before the mount animation can start. I always fast travel on horse because it's twice as fast as on foot so I see it a lot. It depends on where you're at. Some places it almost always happens like just outside the Bruma stable and some places it never happens like just outside the IC stable. I have the alternate Bruse mod and a long time ago I reduced his size by 10% I think and at the time it seemed to help a fair bit but now I can't say really. That's just my wild guessing about it in the real world. In the game world what is going on is Bruse is ticklish and Vilja always carries all the loot which can get heavy sometimes and so she can't jump so well, so I don't mind giving her all the time she needs to mount that persnickety horse. After all she's always helping me out. One thing I do if it is taking a while is I ride a ways away dismount and then Vilja comes towards me and when she gets close I get on my horse again and then Bruse starts heading towards Vilja which puts him in a different position to try again. I used to try and block Bruse's path on my horse and I think that may have helped somewhat but now I just wait.
The thing where "Bruse suddenly turns and gallops away full speed" happened to me when I had to leave Vilja with Heneri to learn a new spell. He was outside the gate and took off just like you said and I able to keep up with him all the way back to the Red Rose Manor where he knows is his home stable.
P.S. "For some reason Vilja now has trouble mounting Bruse." Does that mean this problem didn't happen for a long time?
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Post by jgf on Oct 15, 2016 8:06:20 GMT
This is pretty much normal. ... Ah, at least I know I'm not sinugularly blessed with this anomaly. ... Does that mean this problem didn't happen for a long time? This is the first time it has ever happened to me. Possibly coincidence, but I recently replaced my vid card (years ago I was unable to progress in "Tomb Raider" and "Thief" because I could not swim through underwater openings; eventually I replaced the Voodoo card with a GeForce and the problem disappeared in both games ...how a vid card could affect the physics of a game, especially way back then, is beyond me, but the thought occurs that could be the cause of my current irritation).
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Post by chambcra on Oct 15, 2016 12:54:16 GMT
This is the first time it has ever happened to me. Possibly coincidence, but I recently replaced my vid card That's very interesting. I'm with you, I can't see how but your past experience pretty much says it can. So roughly how long was this common (I thought) problem not happening for you? One year? Two years? One hundred horse mounts? One thousand horse mounts? Just roughly. I know I wouldn't want to do it but if you put your old vid card back and the problem disappeared, that would call for some serious head scratching. Maybe if you had an older ex-game-machine, possibly one that is now the office machine? I know I wouldn't mess with a working computer that I was using daily but if you do learn anything more about this hardware possibility I'd sure be interested to hear about it. Some problems are easier to live with than fix but an unresolved curiosity can be a bugger. Thanks
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Post by jgf on Oct 16, 2016 8:35:11 GMT
I've only been playing Oblivion a year (after thirteen years in Morrowind), Vilja was added within the first couple of days. My old vid card died and I threw in an antique 8500GT while deciding on a permanent replacement (opted for a GTX950); this problem did not occur until the GTX was installed. It is an irritant but not a game breaker; the worst part is if I tire of watching Vilja push her horse around and fast travel away, Vilja doesn't follow; and if I summon her she may not be in follow mode when she appears.
It seems to help somewhat if I position my horse to "block" Bruse, but not always - I've watched as Vilja pushed her horse, my horse, and me ...uphill! (that's one strong lady, glad she's on my side). And once she pushed Bruse INTO a large boulder, only his head and part of a leg visible, then spent a couple of minutes running around and around the boulder, I dismounted and the game crashed.
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Post by chambcra on Oct 16, 2016 14:30:00 GMT
I'm convinced the vid card is the difference. I never would have guessed in a hundred years that could make a difference. I remember I've tried fast traveling on my horse while Vilja was still trying to mount and I don't remember why I quit doing that but I'm pretty sure it wasn't anything as serious as what you describe. I have Oblivion on my work computer just for using the construction set mainly so I thought I'd make some tests on it. I went to Bruma which is usually problematic and I'll be danged if she hopped right on every time. I made a dozen tries from different spots and no problem. That computer has a GeForce 7600GT. Who would-a-thunk-it. Maybe it's the frame rate or Vsync setting?
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Post by Sniffles on Oct 17, 2016 1:39:32 GMT
I just asked my tech about this. In essence he said the game data spooling to the virtual drive includes a lot of graphics instructions. If they get scrambled by a slow or erroneous video card things can go to hell just as fast as a memory leak or corrupted save. Oh yes. Cell transitions like fast travel ALWAYS involve memory swapping and loading.
This was something I had recently been asking him about. After cell transitions sometimes the colors were screwed up. Green became a very bright 16 color type green. When I saw these uglies a game crash is almost certain to follow pretty soon.
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Post by jgf on Oct 17, 2016 12:36:58 GMT
Cell transitions are a rough time in any game - all the current mesh and texture files must be shuffled out of memory and the new files loaded, scripts cleared, etc. - and Bethesda has traditionally been weak here. In Morrowind I would routinely save my game before opening any portal door. In Oblivion I use the pcb command before entering/exiting any town or dungeon, this has drastically cut down on crashes (if the command executes almost instantly - evidenced by the cursor dropping to the next line - you were safe; but if it takes several seconds, especially if you hear HD activity, you were close to a crash and it's a good idea to save before continuing ...if not completely exit and reload). In both games stability decreases the longer you play, 2-3 hours seems the limit before you should seriously consider exiting and reloading.
But contact between objects in a game is controlled by collision boxes and, while evidence shows otherwise, and I'm certainly no programmer, I fail to see how a vid card, whose only purpose is to pass graphic information from the system to the monitor, could affect the functioning of collision boxes. But I am convinced Oblivion does have issues with collision boxes - screenshots of Vilja standing waist deep in a staircase, of a dead goblin buried from the waist up in a stone floor, of two horses merged into a pushmi-pullyu, of Wolfgang inside the base of a statue...
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Post by Sniffles on Oct 18, 2016 1:42:16 GMT
In Skyrim, running about 14 scripted followers with dialogue going off like firecrackers during Chinese New Years, it's PCB at every cell transition now and a save in a new slot, deleting the previous (temp) save each and every time. It's also COC nothing on loading every game. This works pretty well but also displays how glurped up Bethseda did things. I need a special mod, a macro key stroke that tells everyone to shut up and stop moving for a few seconds while I save. The freeze up while a save goes off doesn't quite cut it if a script is running, stomped on, as you go to the menu.
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Post by chambcra on Oct 18, 2016 15:06:41 GMT
It would be interesting if anyone else around here did NOT have the Bruse bug and what video card do they have?
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Post by jgf on Oct 19, 2016 10:40:12 GMT
I never experienced any issues with my old HD5670 card (which died) nor with the ancient 8500GT pressed into temporary service; it wasn't until installing the GTX950 that Vilja began pushing Bruse around.
"In Skyrim, running about 14 scripted followers..."
Lol, I've never cared for leading a group/clan/platoon/posse/gang in a game. In games, as in real life, I'm a loner; a single, voluntary, companion, especially one such as Vilja, can be a welcome addition; but I detest those games where the first thing you do after creating your character is recruit a group of Artificial Idiots who then do their best to thwart your progress at every opportunity, while you spend half your time micromanaging them. They are guaranteed to wander off and get lost, fall off cliffs, make unwanted and suicidal attacks on enemies (not only getting themselves killed but alerting those enemies to your presence), accidentally kill each other (or you), or, if nothing else, just constantly getting underfoot. (Poor Wolfgang now stays at home all the time because I tired of tripping over him; at least Vilja doesn't seem to mind that he no longer accompanies us.) So many interesting sounding games have been recommended to me over the years, but when I find they entail leading a traveling band of morons I move on.
Plus all those scripts running are an invitation to disaster, each one requires extra cpu time and threads, one hiccup and the whole show collapses like a house of cards. That's the main reason I have so far eschewed Oblivion mods requiring the script extender.
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Post by btog46 on Oct 19, 2016 14:19:52 GMT
In Skyrim, running about 14 scripted followers with dialogue going off like firecrackers during Chinese New Years, it's PCB at every cell transition now and a save in a new slot, deleting the previous (temp) save each and every time. It's also COC nothing on loading every game. This works pretty well but also displays how glurped up Bethseda did things. I need a special mod, a macro key stroke that tells everyone to shut up and stop moving for a few seconds while I save. The freeze up while a save goes off doesn't quite cut it if a script is running, stomped on, as you go to the menu. Thing is, with a lot of mods running, the longer you play Skyrim the bigger the saves get and there's just too much to load all at once if you try to load straight into the game, resulting in guaranteed CTD, that's why people have to COC so that loading the save doesn't have to occur at the same time as the game is trying to load all the data for the cell you were in when you made the save. My save had grown to over 52 MB so I had to take action by uninstalling the mods that had the biggest impact, in my case Claralux and ELFX being the main problem, Claralux alone could have over 900 scripts running at dawn and dusk as it switched lanterns on and off. After using the advanced options on my save cleaner tool to get rid of all the crap baked into the save from the uninstalled mods (simply removing the orphaned files rarely saves more than a few KB) my save game is now down to a less frightening 17 MB, and I've stopped getting a CTD on load when I launch the game, fast travel, or change cell. I must apologise for hijacking the thread to talk about Skyrim, sorry....
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Post by Sniffles on Oct 20, 2016 8:45:36 GMT
In Skyrim, running about 14 scripted followers with dialogue going off like firecrackers during Chinese New Years, it's PCB at every cell transition now and a save in a new slot, deleting the previous (temp) save each and every time. It's also COC nothing on loading every game. This works pretty well but also displays how glurped up Bethseda did things. I need a special mod, a macro key stroke that tells everyone to shut up and stop moving for a few seconds while I save. The freeze up while a save goes off doesn't quite cut it if a script is running, stomped on, as you go to the menu. Thing is, with a lot of mods running, the longer you play Skyrim the bigger the saves get and there's just too much to load all at once if you try to load straight into the game, resulting in guaranteed CTD, that's why people have to COC so that loading the save doesn't have to occur at the same time as the game is trying to load all the data for the cell you were in when you made the save. My save had grown to over 52 MB so I had to take action by uninstalling the mods that had the biggest impact, in my case Claralux and ELFX being the main problem, Claralux alone could have over 900 scripts running at dawn and dusk as it switched lanterns on and off. After using the advanced options on my save cleaner tool to get rid of all the crap baked into the save from the uninstalled mods (simply removing the orphaned files rarely saves more than a few KB) my save game is now down to a less frightening 17 MB, and I've stopped getting a CTD on load when I launch the game, fast travel, or change cell. I must apologise for hijacking the thread to talk about Skyrim, sorry.... I just ran the Papyrus Data Transfer enema and now connot save the game it fixed. Would you consider walking me through that rather confusing mess?
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Post by btog46 on Oct 20, 2016 10:44:58 GMT
What tool did you use? I tend to favour this one Save game script cleaner but there are other tools, such as SKYRIM Save Cleaner ALWAYS make a backup of your save before messing around with save files, especially if you use advanced features. You say you can't save now, do you get a CTD when trying to save? EDIT. It may be best if we take this to the SKYRIM forum, it's seriously off topic and threadjacking to continue it in here.
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Post by chambcra on Oct 20, 2016 13:11:51 GMT
I tried capping my fps in the ini file to 30 and I think that fixed the Bruse bug for me. The only problem is that had a bad side effect of making the walking speed way too fast and speeding up other things like the horse mount animation. Then I stumbled onto something called Oblivion Stutter Remover which will cap your fps without the side effect. The description says the default cap = 30 but what I downloaded had the max fps turned off. I tried 30 which was too slow but 40 is perfect for me. In a dungeon my fps would be 120 and I would still occasionally get some stuttering for a few seconds after closing a menu. I've been trying for years to fix that and I believe OSR has done it. The difference is like night and day. Somehow 40 fps is smoother than 120. I haven't had the Bruse bug yet but I only had that glitch maybe one out of ten times. I thought I'd pass this along in case anyone else wanted to try it and speed up the testing.
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