Not yet...let me rest a moment longer

[Sniffles]

@aatrnasyn I'm pretty sure there are several leveling mods considering how hated the game system is. Squishy's method worked for her because she's so detail oriented but drove me bats.
Then looking at Skyrim's version, it's all about training. Keep training, it's a new level every day or two, stop training, you almost stop dead with the leveling. (At level 41 I switched to enchanting, smithing and speech training. Went up to level 51 in less than three weeks. Then, with the skills I had an interest in topped up I quit training. One month later I just barely am at level 53 and most of that was a chance encounter to learn restoration and one illusion session.
Then the next iteration, Fallout 4. The developers knew their leveling sucks max and handed off leveling to quest completions. Same same. Run out of quests, leveling comes to a halt.

So IMHO, Squishy has the right idea and a mod that follows along those lines would be best, but extremely difficult. The mod needs to recognize individual players preferences and interests which borders on the absurd. Complex algorithms dead ahead. All the leveling mods I've read up on are WYSIWYG arbitrary in one way or another. For certain, a compulsive flower picking sightseer with a warped sense of humor is never going to be accommodated.

[Aatrnasyn]

SAAL also includes a mod configuration menu, but the defaults seem properly distributed for my tastes.

[Renee G]

Mar 3, 2024 15:17:54 GMT Aatrnasyn said:

I don't know if Oblivion has an equivalent mod, but Skyrim SE (at least) has a mod that does that skill leveling automatically. I love it. It's called Smart Automatic Attribute Leveling SAAL

SAAL automates Health/Magicka/Stamina distribution at level up based on the skills you used.

Yes there are a few which level automatically. I never used any of them, but I remember a few folks would use these leveling plugins. Dang, can't remember any names! 

But the folks who used them; I remember one of them wanted the leveling process to be seamless, in that, he never wanted to see the "You must find a bed you can rest in" message. He also did not like the "Loading area" message whenever he entered a new worldspace, so he found something which got rid of that. He wanted to have an Oblivion which centered more around the character than the player. This sort of stuff doesn't bother me. I WANT to know when it's time to level up!  

Efficient Leveling... pretty sure that's one of those I am thinking about. 

[jgf]

"one of them wanted the leveling process to be seamless, in that, he never wanted to see the "You must find a bed you can rest in" message"

I can relate to that. I enjoy the immersion in such games, the intrusion of a popup screen where I must take time to allocate points and/or stop to sleep thoroughly destroys that immersion. So in both Morrowind and Oblivion I used mods which removed all that and just gave small text messages that a skill had improved or I had leveled up.

The same reason I do not like most third person games - in a first person game I AM the character, I view the world through their eyes; in a third person game I am controlling a character and just watching what they do. There is immersion in the former, I am just a spectator in the latter.

[dogonporch]

Mar 4, 2024 16:26:49 GMT jgf said:

"one of them wanted the leveling process to be seamless, in that, he never wanted to see the "You must find a bed you can rest in" message"

I can relate to that. I enjoy the immersion in such games, the intrusion of a popup screen where I must take time to allocate points and/or stop to sleep thoroughly destroys that immersion. So in both Morrowind and Oblivion I used mods which removed all that and just gave small text messages that a skill had improved or I had leveled up.

The same reason I do not like most third person games - in a first person game I AM the character, I view the world through their eyes; in a third person game I am controlling a character and just watching what they do. There is immersion in the former, I am just a spectator in the latter.

I use that 1st person mods that allow you to see your entire body rather than just a set of arms.

...that was always as you say...immersion breaking...being just arms.

[Renee G]

Ha! I like Third Person, always game in Third person. Reason being: this is the perspective we had while table gaming in high school. We used lead figureines, ya see.

Only exception is while trying to decorate, or needing to find some tiny object like a ring which dropped to the floor. I'll temporarily switch to 1st. Other than that, it's 3rd Person, baby! Even during archery and magic-casting.

[dogonporch]

Mar 4, 2024 19:53:08 GMT Renee G said:

Ha! I like Third Person, always game in Third person. Reason being: this is the perspective we had while table gaming in high school. We used lead figureines, ya see.

Only exception is while trying to decorate, or needing to find some tiny object like a ring which dropped to the floor. I'll temporarily switch to 1st. Other than that, it's 3rd Person, baby! Even during archery and magic-casting.

Lead figures.

We started with Gygax's Chainmail rules for Medieval warfare which later became classic white box Dungeons & Dragons.

Advanced D&D came later...nice books...had 'em all. First wife kept them (she played)...lost in the sands, now. Sigh...

[Sniffles]

Oblivion start in a nutshell. How to get going without a leveling mod.
Escape prison, go swimming. Place the PC to swim against a rock where it's stable. Leave game to run for around 72 hours. When a stat is near 100 proceed to Bruma then return towards the lake overland, carefully jumping down slopes to take damage but not dying. Repeat the trip until another stat is near 100. In and around a city, sneak, avoid getting seen. Difficult at first but as the stat progresses it gets easier. Third stat nears 100.

Now make a special START save. Never restart from inside the prison but instead use this save with the leg up stats. Additionally, make a pre leveling save. Level up and check the aggregate of all leveling points. You should have 15. Open the console and distribute the points appropriately for your style of game play. Make note of extra points to be applied for your next leveling.

At this point, start game play to your personal preference. As you progress always make a pre leveling save, note the aggregate points, then use the console to distribute appropriately while keeping track of unspent points. Always be aware of if you are exceeding the 5 point cap. Level again before this happens or points will be lost.

[jgf]

I had a brief foray into Dungeons&Dragons many years ago. I think "The Straight Dope" described it best:

"The concept seems simple enough. It’s the application that throws me. There are two main problems: (1) there are one billion rules, and (2) the game requires nonstop mathematical finagling that would constipate Einstein. The rule book is laden with such mystifying pronouncements as: “An ancient spell-using red dragon of huge size with 88 hits points has a BXPV of 1300, XP/HP total of 1408, SAXPB of 2800 (armor class plus special defense plus high intelligence plus saving throw bonus due to h.p./die), and an EAXPA of 2550 (major breath weapon plus spell use plus attack damage of 3-30/bite) — totalling 7758 h.p.” Here we have a game that combines the charm of a Pentagon briefing with the excitement of double-entry bookkeeping. I don’t get it."

[dogonporch]

Mar 5, 2024 0:28:12 GMT jgf said:

I had a brief foray into Dungeons&Dragons many years ago. I think "The Straight Dope" described it best:

"The concept seems simple enough. It’s the application that throws me. There are two main problems: (1) there are one billion rules, and (2) the game requires nonstop mathematical finagling that would constipate Einstein. The rule book is laden with such mystifying pronouncements as: “An ancient spell-using red dragon of huge size with 88 hits points has a BXPV of 1300, XP/HP total of 1408, SAXPB of 2800 (armor class plus special defense plus high intelligence plus saving throw bonus due to h.p./die), and an EAXPA of 2550 (major breath weapon plus spell use plus attack damage of 3-30/bite) — totalling 7758 h.p.” Here we have a game that combines the charm of a Pentagon briefing with the excitement of double-entry bookkeeping. I don’t get it."

....

[Sniffles]

Nods to Gary Gygax filling and sawing dice as he created D&D. Sad sad that D&D was stolen from him in an unfriendly corporate take over. Wonderful game maker, lousy at business strategy.

I briefly worked with a man who was a close friend of Gygax who was present  creating those dice and gave me the low down on how D&D came about.

[Renee G]

Gygax's story is really interesting, right? All sorts of crazy stuff, like he had to hire bodyguards due to folks thinking DnD = a form of satan! And  Avalon Hill turned him down when he tried to get his game published through their organization. Something like that. 

We're really off topic!   Is that okay? 

But yeah, what if Gygax never followed through? What if he gave up in his early days and got a normal 9 to 5 somewhere. Even if DnD never became a reality, someone else would've eventually gotten that idea going. But it wouldn't been the same. 

Anyone here play The Fantasy Trip way back? That's actually what our group played. We used Dnd books to expand our gaming, (more creatures, more rules, more everything) but for the core game (the actual stats and spells and so on) we used Fantasy Trip. 

[Sniffles]

Off topic-icking, way back in my library, Sea of Death by Gary Gygax, signed copy from him.

www.goodreads.com/book/show/235758.Sea_of_Death

I read his book while I was in involuntary residence at Changi Airport. Maybe should reread it in a better frame of mind.